Open source iraf
Sergio Pascual wrote on Jun 16, 2008
Hello iraf.net, we are a group of fedora packagers interested in astronomy software. The fedora astronomy group tries to bring in to fedora prepackaged versions of quality astronomical free software.
One of the packages more frequently requested is iraf, but iraf contains some files that aren't free, namely the ncar graphics routines. x11iraf contains also non free bits.
We are very interested in providing iraf packages to the fedora community. Therefore, we would like to start a project devoted to produce a completely open source iraf. The ideal would be that iraf.net provides us with the infrastructure (version control system, bug/ticket system, etc.) If it's not possible, fedora can host it.
It would be great if the developers at iraf.net could help us in this effort, sharing documentation, patches and your knowledge of the iraf internals. I have compiled iraf from source sometimes and it isn't a task for the faint hearted...
Regards, Sergio
One of the packages more frequently requested is iraf, but iraf contains some files that aren't free, namely the ncar graphics routines. x11iraf contains also non free bits.
We are very interested in providing iraf packages to the fedora community. Therefore, we would like to start a project devoted to produce a completely open source iraf. The ideal would be that iraf.net provides us with the infrastructure (version control system, bug/ticket system, etc.) If it's not possible, fedora can host it.
It would be great if the developers at iraf.net could help us in this effort, sharing documentation, patches and your knowledge of the iraf internals. I have compiled iraf from source sometimes and it isn't a task for the faint hearted...
Regards, Sergio
Chris Hunter wrote on Jun 16, 2008
Justin Pryzby has commented about licensing for various parts of IRAF. In addition to the ncar graphics routines, there are potential copyright issues with math libraries and the "cl" command parser.
http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2005/01/msg00290.html
http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-legal@lists.debian.org/msg28946.html
http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-science@lists.debian.org/msg00321.html
http://justinpryzby.com/astro/code/libastro/iraf.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2005/01/msg00290.html
http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-legal@lists.debian.org/msg28946.html
http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-science@lists.debian.org/msg00321.html
http://justinpryzby.com/astro/code/libastro/iraf.html
spascual
Hello iraf.net, we are a group of fedora packagers interested in astronomy software. The fedora astronomy group tries to bring in to fedora prepackaged versions of quality astronomical free software.
One of the packages more frequently requested is iraf, but iraf contains some files that aren't free, namely the ncar graphics routines. x11iraf contains also non free bits.
We are very interested in providing iraf packages to the fedora community. Therefore, we would like to start a project devoted to produce a completely open source iraf. The ideal would be that iraf.net provides us with the infrastructure (version control system, bug/ticket system, etc.) If it's not possible, fedora can host it.
It would be great if the developers at iraf.net could help us in this effort, sharing documentation, patches and your knowledge of the iraf internals. I have compiled iraf from source sometimes and it isn't a task for the faint hearted...
Regards, Sergio
Mike Fitzpatrick wrote on Jun 16, 2008
Sergio,
I apologize for the late reply (both to your mail and this posting), I've been on travel a lot recently. To answer your specific comments:
The web-hosting company we use doesn't currently offer SVN/Trac but I have a request into them to see whether this is a possibility. Given the overhead of setting this up and maintaining it for what may be a very limited number of users, my preference for now would be to rely on the Fedora resources if this goes forward.
License issues that projects have with the NCAR routines (and others as has been pointed out) can be dealt with in a number of ways:
For NCAR in particular, we're mostly talking about the CONTOUR and SURFACE tasks and their use in other tasks like IMEXAM. For some other licence issues we're talking about the expression evaluator code used in tasks like IMEXPR, IMPORT/EXPORT, and the very frequently used HEDIT/HSELECT tasks.
The last suggestions refers to something I've considered since the beginning of this site: Rather than package IRAF as a (platform-specific) distribution format like a .rpm (or a .dmg, or a .deb, or ....), distribute an install script that downloads, unpacks, installs and configures the system from the standard NOAO distribution files (which are free from license issues). I'd be much more willing to collaborate on a project like this than one which seeks to rewrite a lot of code, and I'm sure users of this site could be used to test the script. If this sounds interesting, let me know.
Cheers,
-Mike
P.S. I've already done specialized versions of such a script for the NVO Summer School or local installs, but never had the time to generalize it for all platforms. It seems like the perfect OSS project; use our experience in defining requirements and answering questions, the resources of the community to implement it, and let this (and the Fedora site) maintain it.
I apologize for the late reply (both to your mail and this posting), I've been on travel a lot recently. To answer your specific comments:
The web-hosting company we use doesn't currently offer SVN/Trac but I have a request into them to see whether this is a possibility. Given the overhead of setting this up and maintaining it for what may be a very limited number of users, my preference for now would be to rely on the Fedora resources if this goes forward.
License issues that projects have with the NCAR routines (and others as has been pointed out) can be dealt with in a number of ways:
1) Ignore them - not always possible within other project's guidelines
2) Delete the offending code - disables some functionality, both entire tasks and commands within other apps, but is easy to do.
3) Rewrite the code - Requires effort to replace the equivalent functionality
4) Do a different project - see below
For NCAR in particular, we're mostly talking about the CONTOUR and SURFACE tasks and their use in other tasks like IMEXAM. For some other licence issues we're talking about the expression evaluator code used in tasks like IMEXPR, IMPORT/EXPORT, and the very frequently used HEDIT/HSELECT tasks.
The last suggestions refers to something I've considered since the beginning of this site: Rather than package IRAF as a (platform-specific) distribution format like a .rpm (or a .dmg, or a .deb, or ....), distribute an install script that downloads, unpacks, installs and configures the system from the standard NOAO distribution files (which are free from license issues). I'd be much more willing to collaborate on a project like this than one which seeks to rewrite a lot of code, and I'm sure users of this site could be used to test the script. If this sounds interesting, let me know.
Cheers,
-Mike
P.S. I've already done specialized versions of such a script for the NVO Summer School or local installs, but never had the time to generalize it for all platforms. It seems like the perfect OSS project; use our experience in defining requirements and answering questions, the resources of the community to implement it, and let this (and the Fedora site) maintain it.
H.J. van Heerden wrote on Jun 16, 2008
Hi all
I would also recommend the last option. We have both Fedora and Ubuntu users in out department and what I had to do in the end to help maintain the IRAF that we all use was to set up a IRAF system with all the necessary files and the bin. files for both redhat and linux arch. and to then put it into a tar.gz archive.
After checking the required packages are installed on the system like xpa and wcstools .... I use a simple .csh script to unpack the files into the correct folders create the necessary links and copy the loginuser.cl and logout.cl files to the login folder. Then just run the through the install part for IRAF and have a working system in less than 10-15 min.
This is just a basic and simple method but it shouldn't be difficult to make it much more powerfull and complicated!!!!!
Regards
Pat
I would also recommend the last option. We have both Fedora and Ubuntu users in out department and what I had to do in the end to help maintain the IRAF that we all use was to set up a IRAF system with all the necessary files and the bin. files for both redhat and linux arch. and to then put it into a tar.gz archive.
After checking the required packages are installed on the system like xpa and wcstools .... I use a simple .csh script to unpack the files into the correct folders create the necessary links and copy the loginuser.cl and logout.cl files to the login folder. Then just run the through the install part for IRAF and have a working system in less than 10-15 min.
This is just a basic and simple method but it shouldn't be difficult to make it much more powerfull and complicated!!!!!
Regards
Pat
Chris Hunter wrote on Jun 16, 2008
It would be greate if the scripts include the option to download & install updates as they become available.
fitz
Sergio,
The last suggestions refers to something I've considered since the beginning of this site: Rather than package IRAF as a (platform-specific) distribution format like a .rpm (or a .dmg, or a .deb, or ....), distribute an install script that downloads, unpacks, installs and configures the system from the standard NOAO distribution files (which are free from license issues). I'd be much more willing to collaborate on a project like this than one which seeks to rewrite a lot of code, and I'm sure users of this site could be used to test the script. If this sounds interesting, let me know.
Cheers,
-Mike
Last post on Jun 16, 2008